Parent pray as girl dies of diabetes...

[JonsZX2SR]

Sad, but true...

Girl dies of diabetes while parents pray (http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/04/28/prayer.death.ap/index.html)

How many people have to die before people open their eyes? The creator put much knowledge and wisdom in this world and gave us the intelligence to use it.

Turning our back on the gifts we were given and praying for a miracle when a cure or treatment is at hand is just plain stupid.

I don't know where these people are coming from. There is a parable in the bible about using the 'talents' (Matthew 25;14-30) we have been given, whether they are 10, 5 or 1.

Just as the servant who received 1 talent was castigated for being lazy, people who are unwilling to take care of themselves or others with talents they have been give abd expect a free miracle are going to get a stern judging in the afterlife.

What is wrong with people ??

[ZetecInside]

Sad.

This reminds me of the Metallica song "The God That Failed", which James Hetfield wrote about his mother who died prematurely of cancer after refusing any medical treatment because of her Christian Scientist beliefs.

[MellowedZX2]

Jon I partially agree, I mean we pray for healing and we pray for miracles and when they don't come on a cloud or with a big booming voice we don't accept it. God works through men, we are vessels for His blessings to pass through, it is sad it happened, I think the parents should have sought medical help as well though. It is kinda like the guy who prays with all his hear to get a job and then sets on the couch wondering why God hasn't blessed him with one.

Joel

[JonsZX2SR]

The point is that medicine and faith are not mutually exclusive... Everything that is on this earth can be used for good, including modern medicine. Intelligence and faith are both gifts from the creator.

You don't have to choose one or the other. That's the lesson from the parable about the 'talents'. Properly and wisely use all capabilities available to you to heal the sick, don't just choose one and ignore others.

People who let loved ones die by withholding medical care in the guise of a higher faith do not folow the will of the creator. No where does it say that you cannot pray while making use of modern medicine.

[Blue ZX2]

That is just ignorance......

[mechtech]

Miracles and healings happen today - they are not really rare.

But I'll bet those parents also use deodorants, toothpaste, etc..
I wonder how all of a sudden they think have this massive faith to cure diabetes [or whatever] when they can't on their own handle the simplest of things.

They throw the stigma of wackiness on all believers who trust in the word of God.

[zxtwou2]

just remember...if you eat the applesauce, there's a UFO on the other side of that commet. so when does the law step in and decide where the linen is between neglect leading to death and practicing ones faith?

[JessicaOfVA]

God helps those who help themselves!

[Hypnose Zx2]

Yup.... ^^^^^^
mom and dad are fuck ups

[MellowedZX2]

Miracles and healings happen today - they are not really rare.

But I'll bet those parents also use deodorants, toothpaste, etc..
I wonder how all of a sudden they think have this massive faith to cure diabetes [or whatever] when they can't on their own handle the simplest of things.

They throw the stigma of wackiness on all believers who trust in the word of God.

Well said!

Joel

[AZN_ZX2]

WOW these people need to straighten out a few things in their life. I'm not religious in any way but I respect other people's religions. But these are the kind of people that make you guys look bad and make people call you religious nuts, or say you guys think God will do anything etc.

I hope these parents get what they deserve and I feel so bad for their kid

[MellowedZX2]

Thats the thing we do as Christians beleive that ANYTHING is possible through God. But, like I said before this leans towards the same idea as a guy praying for a job and setting on the couch and doing nothing to get it then says "God isn't answering my prayer" when he takes no initiative.

Joel

[AZN_ZX2]

Thats the thing we do as Christians beleive that ANYTHING is possible through God. But, like I said before this leans towards the same idea as a guy praying for a job and setting on the couch and doing nothing to get it then says "God isn't answering my prayer" when he takes no initiative.

Joel

Sorry, to be more specific I meant people who rely on faith but don't do anything themselves, when it could have been possible to do it themselves without faith. Though I'm sure faith can help.

Off topic: In older age its been shown that people who do some form of prayer live longer than people who don't pray, and are healthier, but it researchers think it is due to reduced stress, and the calming that prayer provides.

Taken directly from my Psych of Human Development book I thought it was interesting bit of info

[MellowedZX2]

I do understand what you are saying, but everything we do we are supposed to have faith, we aren't supposed to do anything on our own, we are not to receive the glory for God, He is.
I am not saying I agree or disagree with the parents, I do however feel that treatable medical problems can be healed by God through man. Referring to my original post about men/women being vessels that God uses to bless others. Again, there are many people the I know whe have had cancer, and through prayer have been healed 100%, docters have be dumbfounded saying they are that .000001% chance. Hey what ever the doctor wants to say is fine, ultimatly the person has been healed.
We always expect miracles to be big flamboyant ordeals, and when they don't come in that wrapper we tend to not want to take the gift. You know what I mean?

Joel

[AZN_ZX2]

I do understand what you are saying, but everything we do we are supposed to have faith, we aren't supposed to do anything on our own, we are not to receive the glory for God, He is.
I am not saying I agree or disagree with the parents, I do however feel that treatable medical problems can be healed by God through man. Referring to my original post about men/women being vessels that God uses to bless others. Again, there are many people the I know whe have had cancer, and through prayer have been healed 100%, docters have be dumbfounded saying they are that .000001% chance. Hey what ever the doctor wants to say is fine, ultimatly the person has been healed.
We always expect miracles to be big flamboyant ordeals, and when they don't come in that wrapper we tend to not want to take the gift. You know what I mean?

Joel
Yeah once in a while I see an article or something about a doctor who performed a miracle surgery or someone has miraculously been cured when they should be dead. And then people go on and on arguing wether it was an act of god or just good doctoring or luck. As far as I'm concerned it could be a mix of all of them.

[MellowedZX2]

Word... Beleivers call it blessed, unbeleivers call it luck.

Joel

[2000ZxT]

Wow. That lady even looks evil in that picture.

I hope these people get slammed.

[JonsZX2SR]

Word... Beleivers call it blessed, unbeleivers call it luck.

Joel

...what do you call it when supposedly religious types rely only on prayer and someone dies ??

[2000zx2chik]

Did you read the part where they said they were taking the body to have an autopsy done and the Mother said there was no need for that she would be awake/alive by then

[AZN_ZX2]

...what do you call it when supposedly religious types rely only on prayer and someone dies ??

Ignorance or too much faith in God... or simply lack of action

[MellowedZX2]

Your time is your time no matter what. You cannot have too much faith. I am not going to get into any arguements over it.

What do you call it when supposed intellectuals who rely only on their piece of paper and some one dies?
It goes back to what I said about believers calling it blessed and unbelievers call it luck.

Joel

[morningstar2101]

i believe that the term natural selection is appropriate here

[zxtwou2]

i believe that the term natural selection is appropriate here

sorta true...but the parents are the ones making the call on life/death, not the child. natural selection suggests weeding out of the weak...the child was not at fault for his/her own death, the parents' negligence was.

[morningstar2101]

sorta true...but the parents are the ones making the call on life/death, not the child. natural selection suggests weeding out of the weak...the child was not at fault for his/her own death, the parents' negligence was.

sorta true.... ...there are plenty of 'weak' that find ways to adapt and survive. natural selection suggests that the parents werent best adapted to the environment. if their offspring doesnt survive because their beliefs stand in the way of getting that offspring proper medical attention, offspring does not live to pass on those same beliefs. unfortunately, these parents have other kids, hopefully they have learned from this incident.

[Connal]

Ok, the part that really gets me is when they said "She will be alive by then".

Now let me state that I was born catholic, and that I am not a huge fan of organized religion. I believe you should have faith, but not get petty over different religions.

I do however believe that what they said there was blasphemous, and that they are complete idiots.

Praying might work, it might not. However, not seeking medical treatment is insane. Diabetes is treatable, sure you need shots of insulin, and have to watch your diet. But millions of people live with it every day and lead normal lives.

This is the part of religion that sickens me. People get so wrapped up in their beliefs, that they believe if you pray, you can get what you want. Can't make a car payment? Why bother setting up a budget. Just pray that you win the lottery.

Wife is cheating on you? Why go to a counselor, when you can just pray that she will remain faithful?

Whatever happened to "I help those who help themselves?"