Post your Nitrous Setup!

[Kilroy]

Hey, I've been thinking a lot about forced induction again, but I really don't want to go the turbo rout again since it was such a nightmare last time around. Now I understand the basic physics behind "forced induction" and understand that at the ground level turbos/nitrous/superchargers all produce the same result. However, I'm a little unsure about how the nitrous system is set up in our cars and what the necessary/safest path is to take in order to gain some noticeable results at the track. I know that we have to run wet kits, but i just wanted to hear from some poeple that have had experience with them/if it's destroyed their cars... :ropenana:

[needfasp3ed]

and we HAVE to run wet kits... why?

[Thnikkaman]

My nitrous setup:

nitrous express universal wet kit
15lb bottle
auto bottle opener
auto bottle warmer
electric nitrous press gauge
electric fuel press gauge
fuel pressure cutoff switch
purge
electric WOT switch
MSD digital window switch
blow-down tube
relay from arm switch puts my chip into a separate nitrous tune
lots of time on a chassis dyno with full sensors and data logging

50hp jetting brought me from 160whp to 220whp.

had it one the car for 2 years, no problems... until i destroyed my clutch. i hope to hit the dyno within a month or so with 75hp jets.

[krux]

My Nitrous Setup:

Zex Wet kit
10lb bottle
auto bottle warmer
pressure gauge
Sct 4 Position with nitrous burns

When dyno'd I dyno'd at roughley 130whp off and 162whp on. The torque i made on nitrous was 182lbs at the wheels.

My tune is messed up and took way to much timing out of the car when I had dyno. I know I make more than whats posted,but ill have to re-dyno time when I get a chance someday.

[kln5014]

to add to the topic, how much did you guys spend roughly?

[krux]

$600..something like that.I am going to get rid of my nitrous setup once i get in a house. I will be going turbo also like most of the guys on here.

[Thnikkaman]

everything i have in the car can be purchased through summit racing. That could give you an idea of cost... though i did find most of my hardware used on the ebays.

[tre2000zx2]

82021 zex wet , zex machine gun purge module with blue cloud illumintation... $2.50 at nopi 2005 thats right.. 2.50 ..they screwed up the c/c machine but I had negotiated it down to 250.00 in the first place..

the purge solenoid I run is a ebay one.. like 45 bucks..

[wh1t3zx2]

nitrous express 15lb bottle
nitrous express solenoids
nitrous express bottle warmer
nitrous express blue LED purge
nitrous express pressure gauge
blow down tube
i spent around $600 also for all that, i only run a 50 shot

[wh1t3zx2]

heres a couple of pics

[Thnikkaman]

how does the illuminated purge look? i dont think i've ever seen it in person.

My purge is routed to two lines that vent next to the inner turn signals. Looks like a bull snorting... cheesy, i know... but it does get attention!

[wh1t3zx2]

heres a video i found on youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vKYD1VImYw

[Thnikkaman]

that link isn't working for me.

but i did find a you tube video of a lighted purge. Looks pretty good!

[2000_zx2_sr]

i got a dry zex kit with a 10lbs bottle is that going to mess anything up? got it for $100 so i had to get it ive had a wet kit in there before with no tune and no problems but sold it to my brother

[krux]

You could use a dry kit yet you would need to use additional fuel with it. You can't typically do that big of a shots unless you have completely control over the computer and fuel. Dry shots are generally so called easier on a motor then wet shots. Yet wet are safer if your just trying to do a plug and play and go.

[nlsolja123]

I have a complete nos kit sold for a 2005+ mustange v8
it has 10 lb bottle, pressure gauge, and a red illumiation for the purge

it's a 50 shot wet, Also it comes with a fuel pressure sensor adaptor so u dont have to have a 98 fuel rail

[JAX]

My rig:

ZEX wet #82021
'98 fuel rail
Champion copper plugs
91 octane cali pee water

Some pics:

http://www.z-r-c.com/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/zex%20install/bottletrunk.jpg

http://www.z-r-c.com/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/zex%20install/boxmount.jpg

http://www.z-r-c.com/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/zex%20install/zx2zex.jpg

[vega]

any issues or problems jaxx ??

[random_hero]

x2, jaxx

[2000_zx2_sr]

yeah i was thinkin of a bigger fuel pump and possibly injectors

[Thnikkaman]

i got a dry zex kit with a 10lbs bottle is that going to mess anything up? got it for $100 so i had to get it ive had a wet kit in there before with no tune and no problems but sold it to my brother

You cant use a dry kit on the zx2. you would have no way of providing fuel and you will destroy your engine. the only way to run it is to alter your fuel injector duty cycle while spraying to inject more fuel. Venom used to sell a kit that would do this. It would be cheaper to buy a fuel solenoid, lines and fittings to convert your kit to a wet one.


yeah i was thinkin of a bigger fuel pump and possibly injectors

i ran a my setup with the stock fuel pump. I was ok until i hit 220whp. we had to stop spraying at 6000rpm since i ran out of fuel (another reason you should spray on a dyno first. Had i not, i would have leaned out and grenaded my engine). bigger injectors are not required since fuel is added through the nitrous nozzle, not the injectors.

[JAX]

any issues or problems jaxx ??

It could be said. I turned a plug into a smouldering nub of crispy copper and blasted porcelain. Where's that pic... anyway, I was waaay too into running the thing long and hard on 2F2F freeway battles. Who needs a cooldown period!?!??! That 10# bottle sure emptied quick lol Fun while it lasted. It was just to see what a 50ish hp bump felt like before I went further with my turbo plans.

All in all, it worked great, ignoring my tragedy. I was one of several that set their ZEX up this way back when I got it. Just don't blame the setup, blame the operator.

[Unlikely Hero]

Lets get some more pics. I'm stickying this post.
=Jason-

[2000_zx2_sr]

what if i ran a fmu? would that help any?

[2tonejeff]

I am also running the zex wet kit
champion copper plugs
and just the kit works great have not even used a hole bottle yet

[Thnikkaman]

what if i ran a fmu? would that help any?

its not really a viable solution for a dry kit. A fuel solenoid, new lines and a new nozzle would probably cost the same once you considered the tuning time to get it working properly. Even then your AFR would be much, much too rich when you are not spraying. probably to the point that your car wouldn't run.

One way you could get the dry kit to work is a installing PWM control in each of your injector circuits. have a switch that increases duty cycle when the system is spraying. I'm sure this is what is going on inside the venom kit that they used to sell. unless you know exactly what i mean by that sentence and how to design the circuit (or adapt a FMU) its not going to be easy. if you do get it working, you would still need alot of dyno time to optimize the AFR.

[2000_zx2_sr]

well i read the info on the dry zex kit on zex.com and this it was it says: • ZEX Nitrous Systems have an advanced, patented feature called "Active Fuel Control". This feature monitors nitrous bottle pressure and adds or subtracts enrichment fuel. The engine never runs too rich or too lean when engaging the nitrous system.

• ZEX "Dry" nitrous systems activate at wide-open throttle, using advanced electronics that monitor your engine's throttle position sensor. This makes using your nitrous system very easy

[JAX]

well i read the info on the dry zex kit on zex.com and this it was it says: • ZEX Nitrous Systems have an advanced, patented feature called "Active Fuel Control". This feature monitors nitrous bottle pressure and adds or subtracts enrichment fuel. The engine never runs too rich or too lean when engaging the nitrous system.

I looked into this when I was shopping around and it seems this "Active Fuel Control" is just ZEX's special nozzle design and was associated with the wet kit. The nitrous comes out upstream of the fuel spray and is directed across the fuel jet. Supposedly if the bottle has high pressure, the faster flow of the NO2 pulls out more fuel as it's spraying by the fuel jet. I never found an explaination of any novel electronics used in this Control setup.

• ZEX "Dry" nitrous systems activate at wide-open throttle, using advanced electronics that monitor your engine's throttle position sensor. This makes using your nitrous system very easy

They all do this, wet or dry. I recall looking into the dry kit (as it's cheaper than the wet) and I seem to remember that it needs an open-loop fuel system so it can play with the fuel pressure. I do remember for certain it was going to be a hassle when the wet kit is so plug-n-play.

[slammmed]

You cant use a dry kit on the zx2. you would have no way of providing fuel and you will destroy your engine. the only way to run it is to alter your fuel injector duty cycle while spraying to inject more fuel. Venom used to sell a kit that would do this. It would be cheaper to buy a fuel solenoid, lines and fittings to convert your kit to a wet one.

yes you can use a dry kit. I know this personally from experience. Dry kits use a vacuum solenoid to increase the pressure from the fuel pressure regulator. This tells the computer to increase the fuel. I ran this setup for a long time until I accidently swapped the fuel and the nitrous jets. Because I wasnt watching the air/fuel I didnt realize I was running lean, which therefore caused me to detonate and eventually blow the motor.




i ran a my setup with the stock fuel pump. I was ok until i hit 220whp. we had to stop spraying at 6000rpm since i ran out of fuel (another reason you should spray on a dyno first. Had i not, i would have leaned out and grenaded my engine). bigger injectors are not required since fuel is added through the nitrous nozzle, not the injectors

If you had a air/fuel gauge you could watch to see how the engine was handing. Dyno or not you can still grenade your engine. The key is to read what your engine is doing.


There is also danger via a wet kit with the way that the zx2 intake manifold is designed. If you do not have proper atomization the fuel will pool up in the runners and can ignite, this has happened to a few zx2 people I know.

[Thnikkaman]

In order to run a dry system in my engine, i would need to increase the fuel pressure to about 80psi to provide enough fuel for a 50-shot of nitrous and about 100psi to fuel a 75-shot. i would not trust the fuel pump to provide pressures this high at the flows required. This type of dry kit is asking the fuel system to do something it wasn't designed to do. You said yourself that your experience with a dry kit resulted in engine failure.

the advantage of dyno tuning is the controlled environment. there are fewer variables to contend with. Ask yourself this: If tuning on the street was a viable solution why are there so many chassis dyno shops? the population simply measuring HP is a minority. also, i'm not comfortable doing a 4th gear nitrous pass on a city street or highway! going 110mph while trying to read an AFR gauge is stupid.

There are problems with the intake manifold. Fuel puddling can be avoided by using a window switch and only spraying at higher rpms. A more serious problem is using a single nozzle in the intake tract. nitrous is not guaranteed to enter each runner evenly causing a difference in AFR between the combustion chambers. A solution to both of these issues is a direct-port injection system. but these are costly, and people equate nitrous to cheap power so they dont want to invest the cash to make a reliable system. this goes back to the old racer's saying: "fast, reliable, cheap. pick 2".

There are very good books on nitrous systems available. If you are looking into a nitrous system, please spend an extra $20 and read up on the subject. Sport Compact Nitrous Injection by Joe Pettitt is a great book.

[slammmed]

In order to run a dry system in my engine, i would need to increase the fuel pressure to about 80psi to provide enough fuel for a 50-shot of nitrous and about 100psi to fuel a 75-shot. i would not trust the fuel pump to provide pressures this high at the flows required. This type of dry kit is asking the fuel system to do something it wasn't designed to do. You said yourself that your experience with a dry kit resulted in engine failure.

the advantage of dyno tuning is the controlled environment. there are fewer variables to contend with. Ask yourself this: If tuning on the street was a viable solution why are there so many chassis dyno shops? the population simply measuring HP is a minority. also, i'm not comfortable doing a 4th gear nitrous pass on a city street or highway! going 110mph while trying to read an AFR gauge is stupid.

There are problems with the intake manifold. Fuel puddling can be avoided by using a window switch and only spraying at higher rpms. A more serious problem is using a single nozzle in the intake tract. nitrous is not guaranteed to enter each runner evenly causing a difference in AFR between the combustion chambers. A solution to both of these issues is a direct-port injection system. but these are costly, and people equate nitrous to cheap power so they dont want to invest the cash to make a reliable system. this goes back to the old racer's saying: "fast, reliable, cheap. pick 2".

There are very good books on nitrous systems available. If you are looking into a nitrous system, please spend an extra $20 and read up on the subject. Sport Compact Nitrous Injection by Joe Pettitt is a great book.

trust it or not im just telling you my personal experience. When I had the jets for the 75shot right everything ran fine for quite a while. When I detonated it obviously wreaked havoc. If you try switching the 75hp jets around you'll see its about the same as running no jet, ala 175hp. my problem came out of stupidity and not knowing, watching my fuel gauge.

im not disputing the use of dyno's im just saying that its not "required to install nitrous" frankly anyone who is worried that much about their engine really should just stay away from nitrous. It's a dangerous gas that when not used properly can be catastrophic.

the window switch is a viable option but even then the bottem line is proper atomization. which like you said unless you get a direct port isn't guaranteed.

The point I was trying to make was that a dry system is possible on the zx2. and is just as safe as the others if installed properly.

[2000_zx2_sr]

this is very usefull information, i think it will be ok if i get a a/f gauge then

[Thnikkaman]

You would need a wideband AFR gauge. It would be difficult to see a change from 11.5 to 14.0 on a narrow band gauge. This magnitude of lean-out would be sufficient to destroy your engine.


im not disputing the use of dyno's im just saying that its not "required to install nitrous" frankly anyone who is worried that much about their engine really should just stay away from nitrous. It's a dangerous gas that when not used properly can be catastrophic.

in my opinion, i consider dyno tuning as using nitrous properly. This is probably the main reason why nitrous has such a bad reputation as a 'dangerous gas'. in reality, it should be just as safe and reliable as any other power adder. You dont see people bolting up a turbocharger and refusing to spend the time and money tuning everything in. There are risks associated with increasing power but nitrous shouldn't be considered as any more problematic as a turbocharger or a supercharger.

I would be willing to bet that 90% of the engine failures due to nitrous are because the operator refused to check the system properly. For example, you would still have an engine if you had performed your first run on a dyno. The operator would have backed off when he/she saw the AFR way into the lean range before anything happened.

I dont mean to get argumentative or aggressive here, i just wish your statement earlier had read "frankly anyone who is worried that much about their engine really should take the time to ensure that the system is working properly before using nitrous". I'm trying to dispel many of the myths associated with nitrous and make people realize that it isn't a simple method to bolt on 50-75whp.

[2tonejeff]

and if someones engine blows up evan if they are not using the nitrous at the time but have used it in the past they just blame it on the nitrous

[99fordzx2]

Id like to see more pics of nitrous setups if anyone has any.



-D

[Loser47]

and we HAVE to run wet kits... why?
the nitrous adds extra gas(as in N20) to the f/a mixture. the wet kits supply extra gasoline to the mix to keep the car from running too lean and/or too hot

[MrWeeyums]

Id like to see more pics of nitrous setups if anyone has any.



-D

Heres my old one.
~Ryan

[99fordzx2]

Heres my old one.
~Ryan

Thanks thats exactly what i was looking for, I was wondering how the shraeder valve fit into the equation. What nitrous kit did you go with?



-D

[MrWeeyums]

Nitrous express universal wet kit. Came with 35, 50, and 75 jets, i was runnin 50.
~Ryan

[99fordzx2]

Not planning to buy anytime soon if ever but does this look like everything Ill need?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NITROUS-OUTLET-WET-KIT-NITROUS-EXPRESS-UNIVERSAL_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2 el1247QQcategoryZ33740QQihZ012QQitemZ220136929368Q QrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V




-D

[MrWeeyums]

Looks complete for a basic kit. Youll wanna add a purge, bottle heater, and pressure gauge to get the most out of the kit eventually.
~Ryan

[DustyMNZX2]

80 shot here havent been to the track yet
5 pound bottle single purge nos pres gauge on bottle
got like 300 into the kit..

[DustyMNZX2]

http://i37.tinypic.com/t8ns09.jpg

[DustyMNZX2]

10lb bottle now a tune and 105 shot rilly quick now..

[ZX2guy19]

Why are the wires so scattered?

[corby_baby]

Why are the wires so scattered?

you know he has like 7 purges with all different colors. kinda like this :partynanas:

[sparkyzx2]

do u need to beef up the internals any to run nos??

[ZX2guy19]

Nope, but it can't hurt.

[sparkyzx2]

what about turbo and nos????

[ZX2guy19]

Yes, you will need lol. You won't need NITROUS though.

Nos is a brand, NITROUS is the product.

[sparkyzx2]

^^^ dont realy understand r u saying that a n.o.s. would not have that much effect with a turbo???

[ZX2guy19]

Quit calling it NOS. It is called Nitrous.

When you are boosted, Nitrous usually has double the effect on the motor. Example: On a non turbo'd motor, a 50 shot will give you around 50 hp. With a turbo'd motor, a 50 shot will give you around 90 hp.

If you are turbo'd correctly you won't have to rely on nitrous.

[sparkyzx2]

ok i see thanks for the insight and when i say nos i dont mean the brand n.o.s. is short for nitrous oxide system thanks again