Teach me about Nitrous

[AZN_ZX2]

Can Nitrous be used on ATX?

Can I adjust a bottle from 25 shot to 50 shot etc?

What are the short and long term risks of using nitrous?

How often is it recommended to use it?

Will I need tuning?

What is a purge system and do all setups need one?

Will a smaller shot be less harmful to the car?

What is the difference between wet and dry kits? Why is wet better?

Sorry I'm a complete and utter noob with this stuff. All I really know is I want around maybe a 25 shot and Zex is the best brand and I need a wet kit.

[ZX2 Sleeper]

Can Nitrous be used on ATX?yes

Can I adjust a bottle from 25 shot to 50 shot etc?

Injectors i think are different to change, not bottle

What are the short and long term risks of using nitrous?
Your differential, your intake manifold, or engine itself.

How often is it recommended to use it?
It shouldn't be used much.

Will I need tuning?

The higher the shots you go with you will need some tuning due to running rich i believe.

What is a purge system and do all setups need one?
To get the lines pump are released of air

Will a smaller shot be less harmful to the car?
Of course!!! but that means less power! BOOO!

What is the difference between wet and dry kits? Why is wet better?
dry is thru the intake, wet is direct injection to the fuel system.[/B]

Sorry I'm a complete and utter noob with this stuff. All I really know is I want around maybe a 25 shot and Zex is the best brand and I need a wet kit.

looky above!

p.s. we need different cars...

[Apex]

Actually, wet and dry refers to the presence of fuel in the intake. In a dry system, only nitorus is injected into the intake, and sent past the MAF, which will add extra fuel which thinks it is sensing denser air. This is why the dry system does not provide as much power as a wet system, where the intake gets "wet" with fuel. Since the correct A/F ratio is maintained through the nitrous and fuel jets, the wet system tends to produce more power.

[Escort Pimp]

looky above!

p.s. we need different cars...
Please don't attempt to answer questions on things you obviously know nothing about.

[Beodude123]

Can Nitrous be used on ATX?

Can I adjust a bottle from 25 shot to 50 shot etc?

What are the short and long term risks of using nitrous?

How often is it recommended to use it?

Will I need tuning?

What is a purge system and do all setups need one?

Will a smaller shot be less harmful to the car?

What is the difference between wet and dry kits? Why is wet better?

Sorry I'm a complete and utter noob with this stuff. All I really know is I want around maybe a 25 shot and Zex is the best brand and I need a wet kit.

Nitrous can be used on anything; ATX or MTX. Just remember, that adding more power will create more heat in the transmission. If you are going to go with a large shot, getting an external cooler might be a good idea.

You can adjust the size of the shot by using different size jets. Each is calibrated to give you XX hp. So you would use a 25 jet for the nitrous to get 25hp, and a 50 jet for 50. You would use the corresponding fuel jet for a wet kit (only get wet).

Short term effects of using nitrous can be melted pistons, detonation, and all around engine destruction. Long term effects really aren't a problem if you don't go too big on the hit. Just so long as you stay under 50 hp, you really won't have any problems. Lots of people on here have ran 50 shots for long periods of time, and I've never seen a post about engine death over a 50 shot.

I would imagine you can use it as much as you want, so long as you let things cool down a bit after using it.

With smaller shots, you don't need tuning. Anything over 50 and you will need to retard your spark timing, so that way you don't detonate. Under 50 and you should be just fine.

A nitrous purge does what it says. It shoots nitrous through the lines, clearing them of old nitrous. What this does is ensure you get a good hard hit when you get on the throttle. If you don't have a purge, the first time you use it (over extended periods of time), you won't get a very good hit. That's because the nitrous in the lines has heated up, and turned from a liquid to a gas. Liquid nitrous is more effective than gas. (all bottles will dispense liquid, so long as the pressure and temps are kept in range)

Going smaller than a 50 is for preference only really. 50 shots are pretty dependable, and can be ran a million times with no problems. Less is probably less likely to have bad things happen, but when you divide .00005% in half, it's really not a concern.

The difference between wet and dry kits is simple. Wet kits have a jet (and hoses) for fuel. A dry kit will need to be tuned to add fuel. So for a wet kit, you would want a '98 fuel rail, since they already have a connection on there that you can tap in to get fuel. If you use a dry kit, you will have to get your car tuned for it. So that way when you hit the bottle, the car knows to add the fuel it needs.




Basically, the worst things you can do with nitrous are run lean, and activate it at less than WOT (wide open throttle). Running lean makes the engine run hot. A hot engine melts pistons, or detonates, and can throw internal parts to the exterior of the engine. Not good. Nitrous needs to be ran at WOT only, or else you can get a puddle in your intake manifold, which can lead to a violent separation of said manifold from your head. The easiest way to do this is by getting a WOT switch for your throttle body. That way, the nitrous will only come on when you are at wide open throttle, and no other time (when you hit the button of course).

Zex is a pretty good company. I don't think I've heard anything bad about them so far.

[jeffescortlx]

I bet if you nog's ran e85 you could run at least 75hp shot with stock ignition timing. Might need a larger fuel pill and 20-30% larger fuel injectors, but it's worth it.

[DaviDawg]

what about throwing the knock sensor into this equation? (without a tune)

would you need the knock sensor hooked up for a 50 shot or less?
if not, would a 75 shot be "safe" with the knock sensor connected?

[Beodude123]

I wouldn't really trust the knock sensor to do anything specific. We don't really know how much timing it pulls, and exactly when.

I know that people have always had the knock sensor in when running nitrous. The knocker mod is fairly new in the scheme of things, and people have been running 50 shots for a long time. I would say it's safe to run a 50 and no knock sensor. If you can run a 60 or 75 with good gas on a stock tune, you could handle a 50 with a bit more timing.

[AZN_ZX2]

Thanks for the answers Beodude. Is it ok to run it on a daily driver?

[Beodude123]

So long as you don't run it at every stop light hard, I don't see what the problem would be. People run 200 whp turbo Zetecs on stock internals all day long, and don't have problems. I think Escort Pimp is still on stock internals... He's been turbo'ed forever!

[AZN_ZX2]

Will it automatically inject the nitrous in if I floor it or will I have to hit a switch or what?

[ZX2guy19]

Yes you will have to hit a switch and there is a thing called a window switch that you install that turns the nitrous on at a certain rpm and off at a certain rpm.

[AZN_ZX2]

If I have the 98 fuel rail will I need to modify the intake? Or is it one or the other?

[ZX2guy19]

No you won't. I don't think so at least, my line was run right into my fuel rail. Don't quote me on that though.

[AZN_ZX2]

Ok quick over view. A 25 shot can be used safely on a daily driver as long as I am smart about it, let it cool down after use, and don't use it too often. I will not have to modify the intake, I need a 98 fuel rail, and having an ATX is fine with using nitrous. A tune is not needed with a smaller shot, but a purge is.

One last question for now. Is there specific places to run the purge? Is one place better than another?

[gt35r zx2]

The only thing that the fuel rail is good for is getting fuel for the mixture. So you will have to put the nitrous in the intake somewhere , which a iceman intake works well , so that you can tap it.

[Beodude123]

Yeah, you need to make a hole in your intake. Like gt35 said, the fuel rail valve is just to get the extra fuel needed for a wet kit.

You could easily do a 50 shot on a daily driver. There are quite a few people that have, or have had 50 shots.


Window switches are great too. It can prevent over reving (not so much a problem with ATX though). When you have a WOT switch, you still need to press the button to activate it.

[DaviDawg]

hey beodude,
whats the most youve seen/heard of somebody running on a consistant basis without a tune and not blowing internals?

[Beodude123]

I think 75 is the max, but that's pushing it. 50 is as safe as they get.

[jeffescortlx]

A 25 shot can be used safely on a daily driver as long as I am smart about it, let it cool down after use, and don't use it too often.

:poke: Dont be a pussy, run a 50 shot! The only "problem" you'll have is running out of spary all the time. When you blow the ATX do a 5 speed swap. 8)

[DaviDawg]

is the safe 50 shot considered 50hp or 50whp?

[Beodude123]

I think it's engine. But most of it gets to the wheels.

[AZN_ZX2]

Would an MMI intake be ok to use nitrous with?

[ZX2guy19]

Any intake should be fine for nitrous except a stock one.

[J_Mob]

LMFAO-awesome.........now just to fight off what I've been taught in my youth and I'm good to go. (I am not a NOx person either, been talked away from it by builders......but it seems to be the cheapest fix).

[Beodude123]

Why would a stock intake not be good? All you need is a hole to spray the nitrous through.

[J_Mob]

lack of stability for the injector, probably (thin plastic doesn't like being drilled and tapped to much, and a gentle tug would remove anything threaded in.....)

[J_Mob]

Though that is just theorizing there....no experience with the said system being discussed.

[Beodude123]

There are ways it could be secured, but I see what you are saying. Besides, who wants a stock intake anyways?

[J_Mob]

Superglue And Ducttape?

[J_Mob]

Then it would look like my car.....

[ZX2guy19]

Exactly, which is kind of why I said that, lol. If you are running nitrous, you will want a better intake.

[J_Mob]

Is there ways to put nitrous directly to each cylinder? Or to the intake manifold @ each cyl....and would it be of any difference in effect vs down the tube?

[JonsZX2SR]

...a wet system adds a stoichiometric amount of N2O and fuel so additional air isn't required. What this means is that additional air isn't needed to make power actually reducing demands on the intake.

Since N2O is denser than air and cools the intake charge you can actually get more air-N2O-fuel into each cylinder at high rpm. If you are running nitrous with a stock engine you don't need a better intake, but consider a header and better exhaust to get the extra gases out of the engine.

Whatever intake is appropriate for a modified engine should be sufficient for the same engine running nitrous.

I suggest that you retard the intake cam to raise the power band, but only so much that you don't hurt street driveability. You will get back low end torque when you're on the juice and slightly better flow at the top end will get the most out of the system.

A time delay or 1st gear lockout will allow you to launch without nitrous, saving your diff and avoiding going up in (tire) smoke. If you use a time, start with something like a .6 sec delay after launch, until the tires are hooked up.

Start with a 35 shot then graduate to a 50 shot. When you get experience and are more knowlegeable you can consider going higher. for safety I'd recommend making sure you have 91-93 octane in the tank when you start spraying, even with a 35 shot. (Consider it cheap insurance.)

Thre are direct port wet systems which stack the stock injectors on top of the N2O nozzles at each port. An example is given in the link: direct port nitrous injection (http://www.nitrousdirect.com/direct-port-nitrous-kit.html) Unless you are running a modified engine adding 100 HP boost or more, there isn't much benefit from a stacked injection system.

[Beodude123]

Is there ways to put nitrous directly to each cylinder? Or to the intake manifold @ each cyl....and would it be of any difference in effect vs down the tube?

Yeah, port injection. Basically, like Jon said, you add a jet for nitrous and fuel at each intake port. It makes for better fine tuning if you are going to be really serious about the nitrous setup. You can run closer to the perfect A/F ratio for each cylinder with a port setup. Not really worth it for low power shots though. I would imagine it's a lot of work.

[J_Mob]

Yeah. I just figured since we were learning about NOx I'd ask......

Have you seen the little cartridge set ups they used to sell on ebay. Looks like a CO2 cartridge in an inhaler or something. You'd run a line to the cab, then just pop the cylinder when you wanted a shot (in theory, I don't know of anyone who actually tried them).

[Beodude123]

Those are all going to be dry systems, so I wouldn't ever use them. Plus, with such a small cylinder, you would really only get a few seconds of use out of it before it ran out. It's another cheap eBay part. Not worth it really.

[Jaybird]

I have a question to add to the discussion. Can I run with a 50 shot or less with my SCT set for 93 octane? If it is not a feasable, can it be done with adding octane boost to my gas or throwing in some racing gas(thinking of only using the N2O at the track)? My question comes from the idea that I would hate to loose the few extra horses gained with the sct in order to use the N2O (having to loose horspower to gain).

[Beodude123]

If you have a multiple position chip, get it tuned for a nitrous position. That way you can have your cake, and eat it too!

The normal street tune would have all the good tuning, and then your nitrous tune would be slightly retarded.

[croquetgod]

So is it just a bad idea to run a dry setup?

[ZX2guy19]

Yes

[Beodude123]

Oh God yes.